Shrimp and Prawn Experiment

[cargillion]

Shrimp and prawn experiment

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

After consultaion with the Scottish Executive FRScotland, TGA, the TDSFB has been granted the use of shrimp and prawn baits from the 1st August 2010 to 31 August 2010 on selected beats.

The rules for the experiment as such;

All full Ghilled beats from the mouth of the Tummel to Almondmouth were invited to take part. Not all beats took up the invitation.

The fishing with shrimp and prawn will be no more than 50% of the fishing effort and will be limited to set mornings or afternoons during the week.

All fish caught will be returned to the river, without exception.

No fishing will take place without the beat ghillie being in attendance.

Any angler/ghillie contravening the rules will be prosecuted, and an instant revocation of the licence shall be made.


Dave

[stinger]

An absolute disgrace in my opinion. What is there to experiment exactly?
I'd be interested to see the hypothesis.
I will be voting with my wallet. I will be cancelling any fishing arranged if those beats are taking part. I am sure I will not be alone.

[salmostalker]

This seems like another step in the downward spiral for the river. Can't for one second understand what is to be gained from this experiment other than in the short term more cash for some of the owners. Smells a bit like the Dee extension experiment.

[salmostalker]

If this is a reaction to falling rod numbers would it not be feasible to look at the exorbitant prices being charged for what is actually on offer. Some unheard of tay ( tweed also) back end availability this year which will increase. In any event it won't affect me personally as I wont be anywhere near the beats involved.

[cargillion]

I dont have a full list of beats involved but what I would ask (as a ghillie) is that those who are involved are not put on some witch hunt and the paying public doesnt have to participate should they wish not to.
The past 5 years have shown falling catch numbers through July and August but steady counter numbers, it also shows that river levels have been higher in the last five years through July August(grilse time) than in the last 40 years. Falling catches have had a serious knock on effect to the rural economy as anglers vote with their feet, that coupled with a world wide recession/depression it needs to be proved that there are still fish in numbers going through the Tay. The shrimp experiment should not result in any extra salmon not reaching the spawning beds, but hopefully will show that the fish are there.
I would like to point out I personally am not advocating the use of this bait but I am trying to put forward the discussions that have taken place.

Dave

[stinger]

Dave,
You are not advocating it's use, but will you be fishing it?

[cargillion]

Yes Billy we will be fishing it, but like many other ghillies we are employees and as such work within the rules of our employers.
That said I dont think it will be the holy grail that many believe, nor will it be the downfall of the Tay.
Dave

[salmostalker]

TDSFB - acronyms please.

[salmostalker]

The dirty shrimp flingin' ********.

[underghillie]

Jul 28, 2010 22:11:47 GMT @cargillion said:

I dont have a full list of beats involved but what I would ask (as a ghillie) is that those who are involved are not put on some witch hunt and the paying public doesnt have to participate should they wish not to.
The past 5 years have shown falling catch numbers through July and August but steady counter numbers, it also shows that river levels have been higher in the last five years through July August(grilse time) than in the last 40 years. Falling catches have had a serious knock on effect to the rural economy as anglers vote with their feet, that coupled with a world wide recession/depression it needs to be proved that there are still fish in numbers going through the Tay. The shrimp experiment should not result in any extra salmon not reaching the spawning beds, but hopefully will show that the fish are there.
I would like to point out I personally am not advocating the use of this bait but I am trying to put forward the discussions that have taken place.

Dave

Dave,

I deleted my earlier post as i just had one of my long standing Tennant's on the phone who is giving up his fishing with me as he believes there will be less fish up this end of river when the beats below start fishing with shrimps and prawns.

I am deeply upset by this as he is one of my favorite Tennant's.

So i have to say IMHO the boards decision to bring shrimp and prawn has lost me one of my Tennant's Whitch does nothing for the rural economy up this end of the system

But hay ho as long as the lower river is OK

Tony

[cargillion]

Martin as you say the big money beats are 'greeting' because it is these beats who pay 85% yes 85% of the boards income. Personally I dont see what difference it makes how a salmon is caught if it is returned to swim upstream and if an angler has that sport from that fish then it is a win win situation. I can see this is going to be contensious and dont want to get drawn in to the rights and wrongs discussions as this I feel would be a conflict of interests as a ghillie, board member, chairman of TGA so I would encourage debate but I will abstain.

Dave

[salmostalker]

Tony that's sad and hopefully not the start of a trend although I fear it may be.

[stinger]

Jul 28, 2010 22:38:32 GMT Mon The Flee said:

Dave, we've already had bookings cancelled for this period when it was just rumars now its fact prob gonna be a lot more to follow

Most of the middle beats rely on day lets not booked up years in advance like most of the bottom beats. The middle beats are the ones who are gonna suffer the most by doing this

If its a case of it doesnt matter what there caught on as long as there caught they might aswell bring it back full time.

Just opinions Dave nothing personal at all

I agree with you Martin. After all, why was it banned in the first place?
I appreciate your stance Dave, and the fact that you have taken it upon yourself to advise of the decision and as with Martin, nothing personal.
However, I will be writting to the Scottish Executive today and I urge everyone who feels the same way about this barbaric practice returning to do the same.
I will post the contact details later on.
Billy

[stinger]

Aquaculture and Freshwater Fisheries
Area 1 B North
Victoria Quay
Edinburgh
EH6 6QQ
Tel: [phone]
E-mail: [e-mail]

[kingfisher]

Excuse my ignorance on this guys, as I have never even seen the Prawn being fished, far less tried it. but I used to fish the Tay in my younger days just about weekly and knew it was fished by the salmon anglers back then.

I also believe rightly or wrongly, that it was stopped because of the very large catches on occasions and was wondering if this method of fishing was stopped at that time, to?;

1. Preserve the salmon population?
2. Remove the practice due to a perceived lack of skill when compared to the fly fishers?
3. Remove even the type of fishmongers who possibly frequented the river in those days?

In essence why was it removed? if it was to protect the salmon population (even back then) why bring it back now when they need protected even more so. What really has changed? Some one said the river, going by the counters has more fish in it than is seen/caught and is due to the higher water levels etc. Why change it because of that. We have had high water levels over the years with no adverse effect on the catchs. We moan about the lack of rain, now were saying the rivers are consistently too high!!

As I said I have personally no gripe on this, but how can the rules really be enforced?

If more fish are caught down stream (and even returned safely) will that capture of that fish have an effect on its recapture further up river? Thus reducing further the catch count for that particular beat, with the further reduction of fishers bookings due to low(er) catches.

I know its a lot of questions, but does anyone really have the answers?

kf